Western Basketball

[Pavilion]

Teamworkwins,

You are exactly right. Some people in Lathem have been using that excuse for the past 4 years but the results have been the same. There is no way that Coach Kight could have not done as well as what Jordan did last year and it doesn't look like this year is gonna be any better. They lost to Clay at home and Clay had just been beaten by 60 by Minford a few days earlier. Fortunately the bottom teams in their league are so bad that they will probably win a few because of that. They fired Harrop after he won 2 league titles and went to the convo in consecutive years, but that was probably to be expected after they fired Howard at the end of the season when they won over 20 games and lost in the regional final. Poor Kight took over at the worst time possible - no talent and following at least 4 years of winning at least 16 or 17 games and he had no chance to survive. Most of the people out there think they should win 17 games every year and the league title or else they wanna fire the coach. Now they use the excuse every year of how young they are. Very few are realistic from one year to the next in terms of what they should be able to do with the talent level they have. Harrop is a head coach again at West Union and Kight is at Meigs as head coach. Howard is Supt at Jackson, so all 3 did okay despite getting the axe. Probably all 3 of them would still be there coaching if they hadn't been let go. It is obviously not easy to coach anywhere, but looks like that place has a lot of problems and look what running off coaches has done for you. I wish the kids the best of luck, but in 2 years when this awesome team you are gonna have wins about 10 - 12 games and Jordan hangs it up, good luck trying to find someone who will come and stay for the long haul and try to build a program. You guys need to get a young energetic guy and leave him alone. Nothing against Jordan, but what is he, about 70 years old? How many years and how much energy does he have left in him? Probably all 3 of the previously mentioned would have stayed forever, and in hindsight, could it have been any worse than it is today?

[WIFAN-22]

First of all we are not starting one sophomore, we are starting 5. And, how many Justice kids are there in the area? No one is making excuses for this team, we all agree that they need to win now. IF you have been to any of the games you will know that there's still a lot of learning going on with the players who never got any varsity time last year. The speed of the game is the biggest thing that I have heard from the players. It takes time to adjust from JV and Varsity. IF you come see them play later in the season I would bet they will have improved a lot. You have to learn ow to win games, it's not just a given. But, I do agree they should have won both Clay, and Manchester.

And as far as the Coaches. Harrop had 3 starters from the Regional finals team that Howard took them to. My mom could have rolled the ball out there and won 15 games. A good Coach would have taken that team a lot farther. And as for Kite, I'm not getting into all that mess. That caused enough issues out here already. But, I will say this. We have an Ohio Hall of Fame Coach on the sidelines now with 588 wins. Now it's up to the kids, and taking be next step. Developing a winning attitude, and playing together as a team. We have to start supporting this program, and quit building our kids up to thinking they were all stars out of the womb. Too many worrying about their child being on the 1000 point club instead of putting banners up in the rafters.

[teamworkwins]

No one expected Western to beat Peebles, not saying they should have. Not saying Kite should still be at Western either. Western fans need to realize this team realistically should probably win 5-6 games this season. The players need to realize the teams they should beat and get it done. Larry Jordan and his son know the game of basketball. They will get better. Larry's son might be the best thing for the future at Western. Him and Edwards seem to have some fire left. Let them build something, its going to take time. What does Western have in Jr.High coming up? Any help there? Varsity teams are made from 3-4 classes combined. 1 or 2 nice players per class can sometimes make a difference. By the way, the point guard from Zane Trace was a freshman, he had 22 last night. It does help to surround your young kids with experience. That why I was wondering if Western's yound kids were going to able to gain some playing time in the future so there not going through this in 3 years all over again.

[Pavilion]

My point was that even a Hall of Fame Coach can't win games if the talent is not there. Sure a good coach can make a difference but it is really not the X's and O's so much as the Jimmy and Joes that win games. There is a difference between losing games and getting beaten by 30 or 40 on a consistent basis. It just seems that there is always some controversy there with the basketball program and whoever is coaching. Don't know if it is caused by the parents, board of education, community, or the coaches. It is just sad to see the program in such a low state right now. I just don't know what will have to happen for it to get back to at least being competitive or even prominence. I wish the best of luck for the kids of Lathem.
Indianfan4life, you seem to be a reasonable person with realistic expectations, perhaps you should try to get on the board of education and see if you can get things headed in the right direction.

[teamworkwins]

Several classes in a row like they had a few years ago or a couple of transfers. Transfers are only a temporary fix to an underlying problem. Sometimes there is not the talent there to be competetive.

[Runner00]

From what I have heard, the Western Jr. High program is in bad shape as well this year. This results from having NO peewee program until this year or last year is what I was told.

[WIFAN-22]

There isn't much talent at the lower levels, but we do have a peewee program in place as of last year. There is talent on this Varsity squad. If you have ever played you will remember that the light just came on one day, and things started making sense. I think we are close to that with a couple of kids. Folks can say all they want that they are tired of hearing about age, but name me a team that starts with 4-5 sophs every night. Most if these kids aren't fully developed yet. We are in my opinion about a year away from getting things turned around. After another off season of lifting, and playing we should see what this team will look like. We have to be patient, and let the kids mature a little.

[Dunn97]

From what I have heard, the Western Jr. High program is in bad shape as well this year. This results from having NO peewee program until this year or last year is what I was told.

This is exactly the problem at Western. We have always had biddy ball, I was one of the players on the girls team at western and helped coached biddy ball 15 yrs ago, but it does no good if they dont get to be playing in some sort of league. We tried to get our 5th and 6th boys last year in a league but was too late for anything but tourneys and we have some amazing talent in the 6th grade right now if we work with them more. We dont give our youth the time they need to help them compete at JV or HS level. We ignore it and then complain when they get to high school and blame the coaches. The school needs to invest more into the elementary level players more, and that will impove our high school level players more.

[teamworkwins]

Do any of Western kids play OYB or AAU? Little late for the high school kids but young kids can benefit from playing in the off season. Also gives one a sense of what it takes to compete at a higher level and one may not be as amazing as it may seem and work alot harder. I know there are kids playing in the spring from Peebles and I think it has shown to make a difference.

[Pavilion]

If a team starts 4 or 5 sophomores it generally means 1 or 2 things. Either the junior and senior classes are really bad or else the sophomores are extremely talented and they have tremendous potential. If all these sophs are starting just because the older kids are that bad then that does not necessarily guarantee huge success in the next 2 years. It simply means they are just playing because they are the best you have. If they are starting because they are really talented then they should at least be competitive now with most of the teams they play. Athens 5 best players are 3 sophs and 2 freshmen but they will probably win 15 or 16 games against great competition. Not trying to put down the juniors and seniors at Lathem, just saying that because you are playing 5 sophs now doesn't guarantee a dominant team down the road. Sure, they are bound to get better, but it may not be going from 3 wins to 18 over the next 2 years. Teamworkwins said it best. You need to get a couple of players from each class in order to keep a program from getting to the situation they are in now. I know it is probably hard for kids in such a rural area to play AAU or OYB at a young age, but at the very least they need to be playing in some kind of travel league with the kids in 3rd-6th grades. Surely there is a concerned parent with a youngster that would take this on. Preferably a parent or coach at each grade level. Scioto County has a 3rd-5th grade league that plays at different schools on weekends that has over 20 teams in it. Then there are tons of little tournaments at the end of the season. Kids can end up playing over 20 games in a season. The head coach has to make sure this happens if he wants to have a good program. That is why you need to have a head coach that wants to stay around for a while or will be allowed to stay around a while. Otherwise there is no incentive for the head coach to be concerned about 4th or 5th graders if he knows that he won't be there when they get in high school anyway. Sure it is a big commitment from parents, but you can't expect to compete at the high school level with kids that have never done this when everyone else is doing it every year. You will be too far behind to ever catch up! Someone at Lathem needs to make that commitment or just accept that the way things are now is how it is going to be most of the time. Nothing in life comes easy or without a price!

[Dunn97]

If a team starts 4 or 5 sophomores it generally means 1 or 2 things. Either the junior and senior classes are really bad or else the sophomores are extremely talented and they have tremendous potential. If all these sophs are starting just because the older kids are that bad then that does not necessarily guarantee huge success in the next 2 years. It simply means they are just playing because they are the best you have. If they are starting because they are really talented then they should at least be competitive now with most of the teams they play. Athens 5 best players are 3 sophs and 2 freshmen but they will probably win 15 or 16 games against great competition. Not trying to put down the juniors and seniors at Lathem, just saying that because you are playing 5 sophs now doesn't guarantee a dominant team down the road. Sure, they are bound to get better, but it may not be going from 3 wins to 18 over the next 2 years. Teamworkwins said it best. You need to get a couple of players from each class in order to keep a program from getting to the situation they are in now. I know it is probably hard for kids in such a rural area to play AAU or OYB at a young age, but at the very least they need to be playing in some kind of travel league with the kids in 3rd-6th grades. Surely there is a concerned parent with a youngster that would take this on. Preferably a parent or coach at each grade level. Scioto County has a 3rd-5th grade league that plays at different schools on weekends that has over 20 teams in it. Then there are tons of little tournaments at the end of the season. Kids can end up playing over 20 games in a season. The head coach has to make sure this happens if he wants to have a good program. That is why you need to have a head coach that wants to stay around for a while or will be allowed to stay around a while. Otherwise there is no incentive for the head coach to be concerned about 4th or 5th graders if he knows that he won't be there when they get in high school anyway. Sure it is a big commitment from parents, but you can't expect to compete at the high school level with kids that have never done this when everyone else is doing it every year. You will be too far behind to ever catch up! Someone at Lathem needs to make that commitment or just accept that the way things are now is how it is going to be most of the time. Nothing in life comes easy or without a price!

I myself am a concerned parent that has a 6th grade son. We can take them out on our own and put them in tournaments with other kids from different schools, and that gives them experience, but doesnt help them build team conhension with their fellow team mates at western. That is what is needed for western to build a strong team in the future, and to do that the school itself needs to step forward and start putting them in a league in our area. To build a strong team they need to start instructing our youth better. They are doing better this year, we will be playing against different schools, so I hope that this is the beginning, as we have so very talented young players coming up, if we put the time into cultivating it.

[WIFAN-22]

Pavillion wrote: (If a team starts 4 or 5 sophomores it generally means 1 or 2 things. Either the junior and senior classes are really bad or else the sophomores are extremely talented and they have tremendous potential.)

We have one senior on this team, and he has seen little playing time. There are 3 juniors, and one of them usually starts, but was out this week due to illness. The other junior is a backup guard, and could see significant time as the season goes on. But yea, not a lot of upper class leadership on this team. No it doesnt gaurantee that this team will be good just because they are playing so many sophs now, but I have seen this team during the summer, and in the weight room. They have all gotten a little stronger, and developed their skill set. It just hasnt come together yet. I do agree that the summer/spring league play would help this team. But, not all of these kids could afford to go to tournaments every weekend. I dont know what the exact problem is with the program. I feel we have good teachers at each level, and its hard to say that their is no talent. I have seen the talent at times, and get confused when I see them in games struggling. I think also that the expectations that have been placed on this sophomore class is unrealistic. One of the parents at a board meeting two years ago when they fired Kight said that this was the next State Championship team comparing them to the 68 team. They will get better, and they should win some games this season, but we need to manage our expectations of them. Keeping these kids here (at this school) together will be important also. As parents we sometimes put our goggles on, and see things in our kids that arent there. We tend to think that our children are better than they are, and we should believe in our kids, but we need to manage those expectations a little better. For example: Some believe we should use our center inside more. We have no inside game, none, and unless you shoot 50-60 % from the outside every night your going to struggle against most teams in this area. Now some of these kids should develop physically soon, and this will help our inside game. But currently we have noone with the size or strength to consistently give us good minutes inside. Tomorrow is another day, and another opportunity for us to learn, and grow as a team. Keep working Indians. Indian Pride!

[Eaglesnest]

I agree with those that think the expectations for the sophomore class may be a little lofty. They will be ok next year and pretty solid as seniors. But, unless something drastic happens (a key transfer or someone grows significantly), 12-15 wins as seniors would be a very good year I would think. Support the kids. Support the school. Support the program. In the end, how many of these kids are going to the NBA from southeastern Ohio? I wish the luck this season (except against the Eagles).

[WIFAN-22]

I agree with everything you said Eaglesnest.

[WIFAN-22]

After a rough week in which Western lost 3 games, two of which they should have won, Im looking forward to Friday game at Green. The Indians have had a good couple days of practice, and are still up beat despite the losses. This team needs to focus on putting two halves together, and continue to work on their defense, and rebounding. I believe these young fellas are motivated to get to the next step. Proud of the boys, and their attitudes this week towards practice. Lets get that first win Indians. Indian Pride!!!

[WIFAN-22]

Your right kg23 it is experience. I think thats what everyone means. As far as Larry, I think he is setting Mike up, and getting him ready. If you talk to Mike you can tell he has alot of the fire that Larry used to bring to the court. As for the other one, dont know how long he will be here. hmmmm.... Not going to go there, it cost our community alot a couple of years ago. This is a great group of young men, and they will get things squared away. They just got by on talent for the last several years, and now it has caught up with them. They will be ok though. You can see improvements every day. Looking to the future, we have to keep up with the younger kids, and make sure that they are getting the proper training to keep the program moving forward. I know alot of folks dont care for Phil Howard, but he worked with that group of young men that went to the Regionals since they were little fellas.

[WIFAN-22]

Western at Greene tomorrow night. Gonna be a physical game, lets show some grit Indians. Lets bust through for that first win! I got Western by 3 in a tough game.

[WIFAN-22]

Great defense won the game tonight. Keep working hard boys. Garrett and Shanks played very good games.

[WIFAN-22]

Well the Indians travel to the land of the giant tomorrow. Going to be interesting to see how they handle Bias, and Craiger. Two very good players. Im not making any predictions on this game, but will be intrigued to see if Western can follow up on their impressive showing from last Friday night at Green. They will be without the services of the Fite kid until the Holiday Tournament at the minimum. Someone is going to have to step up, and play tough on Craiger.

[WIFAN-22]

Lost at East last night, but very impressed with how scrappy the Indians were. We left with Shanks with a cut over his eye, and Brewster with a twisted ankle. Had trouble with our small lineup, and the small floor. It was oblivious the boys were intimidated by the shortage of room to work. I noticed Garrett, and Lee kept having to look at the floor to see where they were at as far as the 3 point line. Not making excuses East played their game, and did a great job of getting Bias the ball. I for one will be glad when he graduates, hes a load in there. Craiger was Craiger tough kid. Ten days off until the Holiday Tourney, we need to get rested, get everyone back, and get back to work. You can see these young men improving each game. Lets get healthy during the break, and then do work.