2018 Division Breakdowns

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2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Tri-StateYouthSports » Thu Jun 01, 2017 2:00 pm

This was just posted by Jerry Snodgrass.
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danicalifornia
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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by danicalifornia » Thu Jun 01, 2017 2:18 pm

Wow, that's a bigger jump than I anticipated.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by mondayamqb » Thu Jun 01, 2017 3:26 pm

Still cannot tell division placement for some because the enrollment numbers on the OHSAA site are base (EMIS) numbers and do not indicate the competitive balance additions to each school.

The large jump should tell you how much boys basketball has been affected by open enrollment and transfers.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by danicalifornia » Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:13 pm

mondayamqb wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2017 3:26 pm
Still cannot tell division placement for some because the enrollment numbers on the OHSAA site are base (EMIS) numbers and do not indicate the competitive balance additions to each school.

The large jump should tell you how much boys basketball has been affected by open enrollment and transfers.
Especially in comparison to the Girls numbers. The D2 bottom cut line on girls is 199 compared to 211, it really should never be that different.

I don't recall any schools having a lower number in football, so I think that you can likely guess what division a school would be in. Although, it will be interesting to see where schools like Alexander, Meigs, Eastern Pike, Coal Grove, Huntington, Marietta, and Westfall will be, as I recall those being ones near the cut lines.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Thu Jun 01, 2017 6:06 pm

The break down looks good for D2 thru D 4 . As competitive balance for D1 you could be at 363 and would have the possibility of a Mason with a number like 1350 going head to head in tournament . Now that is an injustice and is not fair to the lower end of D1. The balance they are looking at is 199 in D1,200 in D2 , 200 IN D3 and 200 in D4. Their balance is a total of 799 teams and that number is then divided. When will they look at adding a division like Football and truly have balance ?

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Thu Jun 01, 2017 11:54 pm

Truth&fiction wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2017 6:06 pm
The break down looks good for D2 thru D 4 . As competitive balance for D1 you could be at 363 and would have the possibility of a Mason with a number like 1350 going head to head in tournament . Now that is an injustice and is not fair to the lower end of D1. The balance they are looking at is 199 in D1,200 in D2 , 200 IN D3 and 200 in D4. Their balance is a total of 799 teams and that number is then divided. When will they look at adding a division like Football and truly have balance ?
I was actually looking at what things would look like in our area if a 5th division was added for that reason. Initially, I went with the top 80 schools for D1 since in football, it was he too 72 teams out of around 720 and basketball has around 800, but I found that some district areas would be too far spread apart, even for 5-team districts, but with the top 96 schools, it was a much better, and there could be 16 districts of 6 teams. Then around 176 teams for D2-D5 each with 16 districts of 11 teams give or take. The cutoff between D1 and D2 in the 5 division setup before competitive balance was 512 this upcoming year. I also found it quite interesting how a lot of our divisions would look like in our area and could even result in some more conference realignment or division realignment within conferences (Note: enrollment figures used are for this year, but are before competitive balance is calculated).

Division 2 - 267-512 under 96 school D1 - 285-579 under 80 school D1
Logan
Teays Valley
Western Brown
Chillicothe
Tri-Valley
Wilmington
Hamilton Township
Marietta
Zanesville
Athens
Sheridan
Warren
Jackson
(Moves down a division under 80 school D1)
Hillsboro
Miami Trace

Division 3 - 175-266 under 96 school D1 - 178-284 under 80 school D1
Bloom Carroll
Fairfield Union
Washington C.H.
Unioto
Logan Elm
Clinton-Massie
Vinton County
Circleville
McClain
Gallia Academy
New Lexington
Waverly
Zane Trace
Morgan
Westfall
Amanda-Clearcreek
Fairland
Alexander
Meigs
River Valley
Blanchester
Portsmouth West
Chesapeake
Rock Hill
Liberty Union
Northwest
South Point
(Moves down a division under 80 school D1)
Wheelersburg

Division 4 - 110-174 under 96 school D1 - 111-177 under 80 school D1
Piketon
Portsmouth
East Clinton
Eastern-Brown
Oak Hill
Wellston
Ironton
Adena
Minford
Fort Frye
Georgetown
Lynchburg-Clay
Nelsonville-York
Southeastern
Crooksville
North Adams
Paint Valley
West Union
Valley
Huntington
Fayetteville-Perry
Eastern-Pike
Belpre
Federal Hocking
Dawson-Bryant
Western-Pike
Shenandoah
*Assuming Wahama (WV) would be D4 sized*

Division 5 - <109 under 96 school D1 - <110 under 80 school D1
Manchester
Ripley
Leesburg-Fairfield
South Webster
Whiteoak
Peebles
Eastern-Meigs
Trimble
Monroe Central
Southern
Symmes Valley
Miller
East
Frontier
South Gallia
Green
Waterford
Caldwell
Clay
New Boston
Notre Dame
Ironton St. Joe

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:34 pm

That's good stuff.You need to be on the board. Anyone can see the in balance in D1. A real injustice on the lower end for sure . Thanks for the numbers.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by EagleNut14 » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:13 am

If this is correct Eastern Pike should still be D-4. I think 124 was there enrollment number.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by trojandave » Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:11 am

Looks like Fairland and Wheelersburg, two schools that were previously thought to be very close to D2 for basketball, will remain D3. Also, I agree with Truth&Fiction that D1 is structured unfairly because of the huge discrepancy in enrollment. I just don't agree that each division has to have the same number of teams. There really should be 5 divisions in basketball, dividing up D1 into two divisions.......and I have long been an advocate for no more than 4 divisions......but I have changed my mindset on that issue.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by danicalifornia » Sat Jun 03, 2017 12:25 pm

Still have to account for the competitive balance additions based on open enrollment. So we won't know for sure where everyone will sit until the 6th.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Sportsman » Sat Jun 03, 2017 4:03 pm

Fairland is very close to D/2 with 205 enrollment . Burg for sure will be D/3. Eastern will go D/3 with competitive balance.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by bbjunky81 » Sat Jun 03, 2017 5:21 pm

Competitive balance will hurt some schools! Remember, coming after 7th grade and living out of district is +5.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by art_vandelay » Sat Jun 03, 2017 8:49 pm

bbjunky81 wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 5:21 pm
Competitive balance will hurt some schools! Remember, coming after 7th grade and living out of district is +5.
Had this conversation earlier today...hope some schools did their homework before their offseason additions*

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:38 pm

trojandave wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:11 am
Looks like Fairland and Wheelersburg, two schools that were previously thought to be very close to D2 for basketball, will remain D3. Also, I agree with Truth&Fiction that D1 is structured unfairly because of the huge discrepancy in enrollment. I just don't agree that each division has to have the same number of teams. There really should be 5 divisions in basketball, dividing up D1 into two divisions.......and I have long been an advocate for no more than 4 divisions......but I have changed my mindset on that issue.
I'm glad someone else feels this way . There's around 75 schools with the enrollment numbers 550 and above . With a slight movement this could work for a 5 div. Does this make sense? What is the down side? Looks like a lot of up side to me . If I was a n AD or Supt. with my school on the low end of D1 I would be knocking on the States Door to get a real competitive Balance . Thanks trojandave always enjoy your input!

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by danicalifornia » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:52 pm

Truth&fiction wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:38 pm
trojandave wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:11 am
Looks like Fairland and Wheelersburg, two schools that were previously thought to be very close to D2 for basketball, will remain D3. Also, I agree with Truth&Fiction that D1 is structured unfairly because of the huge discrepancy in enrollment. I just don't agree that each division has to have the same number of teams. There really should be 5 divisions in basketball, dividing up D1 into two divisions.......and I have long been an advocate for no more than 4 divisions......but I have changed my mindset on that issue.
I'm glad someone else feels this way . There's around 75 schools with the enrollment numbers 550 and above . With a slight movement this could work for a 5 div. Does this make sense? What is the down side? Looks like a lot of up side to me . If I was a n AD or Supt. with my school on the low end of D1 I would be knocking on the States Door to get a real competitive Balance . Thanks trojandave always enjoy your input!
I coached at a very low end D1 in baseball and we had to play Mason in the tournament...yeah, totally unfair playing field overall.

I feel like a 5th division for basketball and baseball would even up the playing field greatly. Heck, they don't even need to have completely even divisions school wise to make it a more even playing field. Just don't do what Nevada does where they shift which half of the state gets more teams to the state tournament based on where the finals are located, that's a terrible idea haha

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Sat Jun 03, 2017 10:05 pm

The largest schools do not complain to the State so they must think alls well. Bottom line it makes it more fair to the student athlete and that should be enough to make a case for change .

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Sun Jun 04, 2017 3:08 am

danicalifornia wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:52 pm
Truth&fiction wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:38 pm
trojandave wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:11 am
Looks like Fairland and Wheelersburg, two schools that were previously thought to be very close to D2 for basketball, will remain D3. Also, I agree with Truth&Fiction that D1 is structured unfairly because of the huge discrepancy in enrollment. I just don't agree that each division has to have the same number of teams. There really should be 5 divisions in basketball, dividing up D1 into two divisions.......and I have long been an advocate for no more than 4 divisions......but I have changed my mindset on that issue.
I'm glad someone else feels this way . There's around 75 schools with the enrollment numbers 550 and above . With a slight movement this could work for a 5 div. Does this make sense? What is the down side? Looks like a lot of up side to me . If I was a n AD or Supt. with my school on the low end of D1 I would be knocking on the States Door to get a real competitive Balance . Thanks trojandave always enjoy your input!
I coached at a very low end D1 in baseball and we had to play Mason in the tournament...yeah, totally unfair playing field overall.

I feel like a 5th division for basketball and baseball would even up the playing field greatly. Heck, they don't even need to have completely even divisions school wise to make it a more even playing field. Just don't do what Nevada does where they shift which half of the state gets more teams to the state tournament based on where the finals are located, that's a terrible idea haha
I think Basketball (Boys and Girls), Baseball/Softball, and Volleyball all eventually should go up to 5 divisions. Take the top 12% in terms of enrollment (96 schools) and there's D1; would've done the top 10% like football (80 schools in the sports listed above), but since everyone already qualifies the tournament in all these sports unlike football and the top 96 schools creates better districts than 80 schools, especially Northwest region of Ohio, I went with the top 12%. As for D2-D5, they are split as evenly possible around 22% for each division or around 176 schools, which I feel can make the field even more fair, or 16 districts of 11 schools for each division.

I also feel like with this proposal, districts should be as equal as possible, especially D1 with 16 districts of 6 schools each. D2-D5 can be a little more flexible if it makes more geographical sense for one district to have 10 schools in a district while a neighboring district can go up to 12 as long as they're within 10-12. I find it unfair for some when a regional has 2 districts of like 14 and 15 when the other 2 have 9 and 10 or a couple have 9 and 10 and the other two have 15 and 19. If the geography is there, try to make things more even for the entire field. I can understand if geography create difficulty for an even bracket though.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by jumphigh » Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:16 am

If you really want to see an injustice to the students look at track and field. There are only 3 division but there are 3 divisions yet there are 800 schools that scored a point or more at the district level. That means the big d1 schools have 4 times the athletes to choose from as the small schools.

It just does not seem competitive, balanced or fair

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:55 am

jumphigh wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:16 am
If you really want to see an injustice to the students look at track and field. There are only 3 division but there are 3 divisions yet there are 800 schools that scored a point or more at the district level. That means the big d1 schools have 4 times the athletes to choose from as the small schools.

It just does not seem competitive, balanced or fair
I have seen that too but since this was a Basketball Forum I did not mention Track , but you are correct . When you have 2 to 4 times the athletes that is not competitive Balance no matter what sport we are talking about. The State needs to get this done ! Surely they can see this .

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by 1987chieftains » Mon Jun 05, 2017 12:03 pm

Truth&fiction wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:55 am
jumphigh wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:16 am
If you really want to see an injustice to the students look at track and field. There are only 3 division but there are 3 divisions yet there are 800 schools that scored a point or more at the district level. That means the big d1 schools have 4 times the athletes to choose from as the small schools.

It just does not seem competitive, balanced or fair
I have seen that too but since this was a Basketball Forum I did not mention Track , but you are correct . When you have 2 to 4 times the athletes that is not competitive Balance no matter what sport we are talking about. The State needs to get this done ! Surely they can see this .
they might see it but do they really care.
AT THE RESERVATION

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Mon Jun 05, 2017 12:53 pm

If they are truly looking out for the Student Athlete it would be a no brainer . If they have their own Agenda you could be right . ALL SCHOOLS MATTER!

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:40 pm

If OHSAA decided to add divisions, especially to split up the top of D1 into a division, here's an idea that could be looked at. Here's what I think the current divisional breakdown looks like and then my proposed idea. Also worth noting the winter sports division breakdowns come out tomorrow.

Current Divisional Breakdown
1-100 Teams - 1 Division
Girls Field Hockey
Girls Gymnastics
Ice Hockey

101-400 Teams - 2 Divisions
Boys and Girls Bowling
Girls Golf
Boys and Girls Lacrosse
Boys and Girls Swimming & Diving
Boys and Girls Tennis

401-700 Teams - 3 Divisions
Boys and Girls Cross Country
Boys Golf
Boys and Girls Soccer
Boys and Girls Track & Field
Team and Individual Wrestling

701-800 Teams - 4 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance)

Baseball
Boys and Girls Basketball
Softball
Volleyball

Football - 7 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance/Top 10% Largest Enrollment for D1)


Proposed Divisional Breakdown
1-100 Teams - 1 Division
Girls Field Hockey
Girls Gymnastics
Ice Hockey

101-300 Teams - 2 Divisions
Boys and Girls Lacrosse
Boys and Girls Swimming & Diving

301-500 Teams - 3 Divisions
Boys and Girls Bowling
Girls Golf
Boys and Girls Tennis
Team and Individual Wrestling

501-700 Teams - 4 Divisions
Boys and Girls Cross Country
Boys Golf
Boys and Girls Soccer
Boys and Girls Track & Field

701-800 Teams - 5 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance/Top 12% Largest Enrollment for D1)

Baseball
Boys and Girls Basketball
Softball
Volleyball

Football - 7 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance/Top 10% Largest Enrollment for D1)

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:07 pm

GoBucks1047 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2017 10:40 pm
If OHSAA decided to add divisions, especially to split up the top of D1 into a division, here's an idea that could be looked at. Here's what I think the current divisional breakdown looks like and then my proposed idea. Also worth noting the winter sports division breakdowns come out tomorrow.

Current Divisional Breakdown
1-100 Teams - 1 Division
Girls Field Hockey
Girls Gymnastics
Ice Hockey

101-400 Teams - 2 Divisions
Boys and Girls Bowling
Girls Golf
Boys and Girls Lacrosse
Boys and Girls Swimming & Diving
Boys and Girls Tennis

401-700 Teams - 3 Divisions
Boys and Girls Cross Country
Boys Golf
Boys and Girls Soccer
Boys and Girls Track & Field
Team and Individual Wrestling

701-800 Teams - 4 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance)

Baseball
Boys and Girls Basketball
Softball
Volleyball

Football - 7 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance/Top 10% Largest Enrollment for D1)


Proposed Divisional Breakdown
1-100 Teams - 1 Division
Girls Field Hockey
Girls Gymnastics
Ice Hockey

101-300 Teams - 2 Divisions
Boys and Girls Lacrosse
Boys and Girls Swimming & Diving

301-500 Teams - 3 Divisions
Boys and Girls Bowling
Girls Golf
Boys and Girls Tennis
Team and Individual Wrestling

501-700 Teams - 4 Divisions
Boys and Girls Cross Country
Boys Golf
Boys and Girls Soccer
Boys and Girls Track & Field

701-800 Teams - 5 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance/Top 12% Largest Enrollment for D1)

Baseball
Boys and Girls Basketball
Softball
Volleyball

Football - 7 Divisions
(Uses Competitive Balance/Top 10% Largest Enrollment for D1)
Good break down . Can we get some more push for this ? Competitive Balance would be as good as possible and nothing less with 5 Div in Basketball ,Baseball ,softball and Volleyball. Track expanded to 4 would add volumes to Ohio High School sports.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by danicalifornia » Tue Jun 06, 2017 12:21 pm

The press release will be coming about 1 PM for the divisional breakdown.

Although, I'd much rather talk hypotheticals instead of seeing the inside the box solutions that the OHSAA will provide us with.

Edit: although they said June 6 as of last week, apparently they sent out something to the media yesterday saying that Winter sports wouldn't be announced until Thursday. What makes this even better is that they clearly had it figured out on June 1.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:20 pm

Probably seen this topic and was like, let's give them some suspense and pushing the release back a couple days :P :lol:

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Truth&fiction » Tue Jun 06, 2017 8:15 pm

GoBucks1047 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:20 pm
Probably seen this topic and was like, let's give them some suspense and pushing the release back a couple days :P :lol:
I doubt they will listen to this Forum but maybe they should .

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Tri-StateYouthSports » Thu Jun 08, 2017 10:33 am

2017-18 Boys Basketball Divisional Assignments are posted.

http://www.ohsaa.org/sports/boysbasketball/2018

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by tvc_fan » Thu Jun 08, 2017 11:08 am

Sweet Meigs dropped to d3...Pretty excited about that.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by danicalifornia » Thu Jun 08, 2017 11:56 am

Chillicothe to D1

Fairland, Westfall, Zane Trace to D2

Eastern Pike, Meigs, and Western to D3

I think that is all of the changes for the SE District.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:12 pm

I think Western to D3 was the biggest surprise in our area.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:24 pm

Dawson-Bryant (Coal Grove) down to D4. Belpre just missed moving up to D3 by a couple boys.

SEODAB school breakdown by divisions
D1 - 2 schools (to Central)
D2 - 20 schools
D3 - 28 schools
D4 - 21 schools
Last edited by GoBucks1047 on Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 12:28 pm

And the page went down...

Edit: Page is back up!
Last edited by GoBucks1047 on Thu Jun 08, 2017 3:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by trojandave » Thu Jun 08, 2017 2:58 pm

For especially Chillicothe and Fairland, the bump up is not the most welcome news. It will be much tougher to advance in the tournament for the Cavaliers in D1 and Dragons in D2. With FHS going up to D2, schools like Oak Hill, Portsmouth, Wheelersburg, and Ironton all could benefit from this shift in power. It's still very possible for the Dragons (all 5 starters back) to make the regional, but winning the district will be tougher with schools like Warren, Fairfield Union, Unioto, and Vinton County traditionally in the mix for that district title. Winning the regional most likely would mean a matchup with a Central District school, in which the SE district has had a dismal record against them the past half decade.

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by Raider6309 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 3:09 pm

trojandave wrote:
Thu Jun 08, 2017 2:58 pm
For especially Chillicothe and Fairland, the bump up is not the most welcome news. It will be much tougher to advance in the tournament for the Cavaliers in D1 and Dragons in D2. With FHS going up to D2, schools like Oak Hill, Portsmouth, Wheelersburg, and Ironton all could benefit from this shift in power. It's still very possible for the Dragons (all 5 starters back) to make the regional, but winning the district will be tougher with schools like Warren, Fairfield Union, Unioto, and Vinton County traditionally in the mix for that district title. Winning the regional most likely would mean a matchup with a Central District school, in which the SE district has had a dismal record against them the past half decade.
D2 Regionals will be tough in Athens. Eastmoor, Fairfield Union, and Fairland bring back everything. Winner gets SVSM

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Re: 2018 Division Breakdowns

Post by GoBucks1047 » Thu Jun 08, 2017 3:37 pm

Looking at the numbers, there's already the potential in D3 that Southeast could be paired with Central (2 districts-2 districts) while the East would be paired with the Northeast (1 district-3 districts).

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