Villa-Angela St. Joseph's 73 Fairland 50 (2017 Final Four)

[YOU'RE TIGER BAIT]

dutch you know it's true.and we is still buddies ain't we. -------------------------------- when someone says vasj could have won d1. hit kinda makes ya wonder. it's obvious as my belly.

good luck Friday to the fairland dragons. beat the brakes off'n them city fellers.

[TheFlyingDutchman]

Always Bait. Until something improves with inner city education there will be a mass exodus to Private schools and suberb schools. I do agree that some of these small schools that are popping up are basketball factories and very well might be recruiting but how do you prove that ?

[TVC]

Private schools have advantages over the public schools which propel them over these public schools. Why not make a separate division for these private schools to compete against each other rather than them beating up on all the public schools? Let the kids that are a part of the public high schools have the chance to hoist a championship trophy at the end of their season and make all their hard work pay off. Splitting the public and private schools would level the playing field. It is something that should be done.

This was from an article in PA. Same ole story everywhere. Only people that cant see it are the privates themselves and those blinded by $$$

[sportsmom20]

It is the same story everywhere right now. Went and watched the ladies West Virginia state finals weekend before last, same story. Public school vs. private school. In talking with people around at that game, the state also entertained making two separate divisions a couple of years back. The argument from the private schools is the distance they would have to drive to play other private schools during season and that was not something they wanted to have their student athletes endure. Now I am not sure if that is a valid concern or point, but something that state's private schools used to stop the split.


Good luck to the Dragons, lots of support coming your way!

[LucasDavenport]

Truly looking forward to watching Fairland trying to Slay The Dragon!!

Side note: Perhaps with all the new schools popping up in some of the bigger cities they will start to spread the talent a little more evenly? Canabalize themselves?

It's interesting that the Traditional Private Schools don't bother me -// maybe because when Cincinnati Moeller comes to the state tournament they will bring a fan base and tradition. It's the new ones with 50 people at a tournament game that give me pause.

The bigger public schools do similar things : In Dayton if you are a great athlete you usually end up at Dunbar. The elementary teachers will tell you -- those 3 will end up at Dunbar....

Maybe our Local Schools should do that. Designate Schools for academics and musical programs and athletics and elementary students go to the best suited for them in that area. That way every school wouldn't have to fund a band program or a musical.....,

Wait this is making too much sense..... I just realized if I lived in Cincinnati my kids would have gone to Roger Bacon and Mount Notre Dame.....

The system is fine.


Go Fairland. Represent! You are carrying a bigger banner now.

[dragonalum]

The argument from the private schools is the distance they would have to drive to play other private schools during season and that was not something they wanted to have their student athletes endure. Now I am not sure if that is a valid concern or point, but something that state's private schools used to stop the split.

This is a valid concern for West Virginia schools.

I'll use St. Joe (Huntington) for an example:
Charleston Catholic: 50 miles away
Parkersburg Catholic: 104 miles away
Notre Dame (Clarksburg): 174 miles away

While there are other Christian schools in Huntington, Teays Valley, etc. not all of them have athletics, and the majority of them are much smaller than the Catholic schools. Not only that, but in WV there are only 7 Catholic high schools [St Joe (Huntington), Charleston, Parkersburg, Wheeling, Notre Dame (Clarksburg), Bishop Donahue (Moundsville), Madonna (Weirton)] so to have a completely separate tournament, etc. for just those schools would be a lot of money and a lot of resources.

Also, just for arguments sake, while HSJ and Wheeling Central have had a lot of success in athletics, this is the first time that Notre Dame has ever won anything.

[king kong]

Side note: Perhaps with all the new schools popping up in some of the bigger cities they will start to spread the talent a little more evenly? Canabalize themselves?

It's interesting that the Traditional Private Schools don't bother me -// maybe because when Cincinnati Moeller comes to the state tournament they will bring a fan base and tradition. It's the new ones with 50 people at a tournament game that give me pause.

VASJ is 5 miles from Euclid High School, Euclid has 652 boys. Easy to see why if you go fishing in a small pond, stocked with record sized fish, its a little easier to catch a winner. Versus, small, poor rural schools who are fishing in oceans stocked with one or 2 decent sized fish! lol

[mrwonderful]

To start with trying to compare WV to Ohio when it comes to private vs Public Schools is like comparing the firepower of a BB Gun to a 30-06.....I'll say this for the last time. Several Public Schools recruit just like the privates do....My god Ironton did for years...They were the Lawrence county all-stars....Wheelersburg is the Scioto County All-Stars. Chesapeake did it in Basketball for years when Norm was there......A lot of your Public Schools have and are doing the same thing.... Steubenville is one.....I realize Schools like Moeller have an advantage but there's huge public Schools doing same thing....There's small Schools who do it....Like I said earlier the main difference is our Area doesn't have the population as a Columbus, Cleveland, Ect.....but it goes on here too......Everyone knows it....

[YOU'RE TIGER BAIT]

Always Bait. Until something improves with inner city education there will be a mass exodus to Private schools and suberb schools. I do agree that some of these small schools that are popping up are basketball factories and very well might be recruiting but how do you prove that ?

I heard that I remember watching Youngstown ursiline play in football state championship games and wonder if they could not have won in every division before. and their schedules were brutal, playing teams any size. yet be like d6.

[YOU'RE TIGER BAIT]

Side note: Perhaps with all the new schools popping up in some of the bigger cities they will start to spread the talent a little more evenly? Canabalize themselves?

It's interesting that the Traditional Private Schools don't bother me -// maybe because when Cincinnati Moeller comes to the state tournament they will bring a fan base and tradition. It's the new ones with 50 people at a tournament game that give me pause.

VASJ is 5 miles from Euclid High School, Euclid has 652 boys. Easy to see why if you go fishing in a small pond, stocked with record sized fish, its a little easier to catch a winner. Versus, small, poor rural schools who are fishing in oceans stocked with one or 2 decent sized fish! lol

kong hit the nail right on the head.

[YOU'RE TIGER BAIT]

I don't know why it seems so hard for some to understand, great reference by kong.

[1906]

To start with trying to compare WV to Ohio when it comes to private vs Public Schools is like comparing the firepower of a BB Gun to a 30-06.....I'll say this for the last time. Several Public Schools recruit just like the privates do....My god Ironton did for years...They were the Lawrence county all-stars....Wheelersburg is the Scioto County All-Stars. Chesapeake did it in Basketball for years when Norm was there......A lot of your Public Schools have and are doing the same thing.... Steubenville is one.....I realize Schools like Moeller have an advantage but there's huge public Schools doing same thing....There's small Schools who do it....Like I said earlier the main difference is our Area doesn't have the population as a Columbus, Cleveland, Ect.....but it goes on here too......Everyone knows it....

thank you for this post, some don't want to accept reality.

[icanpickem]

To start with trying to compare WV to Ohio when it comes to private vs Public Schools is like comparing the firepower of a BB Gun to a 30-06.....I'll say this for the last time. Several Public Schools recruit just like the privates do....My god Ironton did for years...They were the Lawrence county all-stars....Wheelersburg is the Scioto County All-Stars. Chesapeake did it in Basketball for years when Norm was there......A lot of your Public Schools have and are doing the same thing.... Steubenville is one.....I realize Schools like Moeller have an advantage but there's huge public Schools doing same thing....There's small Schools who do it....Like I said earlier the main difference is our Area doesn't have the population as a Columbus, Cleveland, Ect.....but it goes on here too......Everyone knows it....

Good post

[LucasDavenport]

I am not saying it's fair. Trust me. In 2005 when Africentric defeated South Webster in the Regional Finals and then went on to easily win State only to have their title stripped from them ..... sour taste. That South Webster team has been largely forgotten and it's a Shame.
The 04 team was defeated in the final 4 on a buzzer beater by Holgate and the 06 team won state. Think about that 3 year run!! Africentric was in its infancy and in Division 4 and somehow had Division 1 athletes.

Truth is simple --- until the Public schools demand change it won't happen. The OHSAA would be stupid to change something that works for them.

Or it negatively affects football. And that's hard to see happening when some of the most storied Ohio programs are private.

So we must adapt. Play the game the same way. Get better. If something is easy then it's no fun anyway.

We even point out on here with regularity when one of ours is not "homegrown". We use that term as a badge of honor. I think back to those 2004 and 2005 South Webster teams. Both 100% homegrown. And Then Africentric and then the 2006 team who had 1 move in (Waginger) and I see some on here devalue that title because SW wasn't 100% homegrown..... crazy.

Good luck to Fairland. It should be fun to watch them in the Schott!

[dragonalum]

Maybe our Local Schools should do that. Designate Schools for academics and musical programs and athletics and elementary students go to the best suited for them in that area.

The problem with this is that you have several BOEs versus a singular administrative unit like in Cincy, Columbus, or even in a "county system" like they have in West Virginia and Kentucky. Not to mention, most of Ohio's schools have "open enrollment," so a kid living in the Symmes Valley District could enroll at Fairland or Chesapeake if they wanted to.

That way every school wouldn't have to fund a band program or a musical.....,

It doesn't work that way. Every school offers the same "core" group of classes. What makes a magnet school a magnet school is that they offer more and beyond the traditional classes in a particular area.

I just realized if I lived in Cincinnati my kids would have gone to Roger Bacon and Mount Notre Dame.....

Why pay tuition to two different schools? RB is co-ed.

[LucasDavenport]

Mount Notre Dame is a volleyball school.

We have open enrollment? You mean we could already be doing these same things? And still be getting beat by schools who are doing these things who only happen to be situated closer to High Population Areas? I'm shocked.

We are complaining about being Rural Southern Ohio. I like where we live. The disadvantages are obvious. It seems to me that we would prefer to ask the rest of the state to give up their advantages.

The schools in the MAC in the northwestern part of the state seemed to have found a way to compete. Why can't we? Complaining about our disadvantages is not a way to compete.

[dragonalum]

To start with trying to compare WV to Ohio when it comes to private vs Public Schools is like comparing the firepower of a BB Gun to a 30-06.....I'll say this for the last time. Several Public Schools recruit just like the privates do....My god Ironton did for years...They were the Lawrence county all-stars....Wheelersburg is the Scioto County All-Stars. Chesapeake did it in Basketball for years when Norm was there......A lot of your Public Schools have and are doing the same thing.... Steubenville is one.....I realize Schools like Moeller have an advantage but there's huge public Schools doing same thing....There's small Schools who do it....Like I said earlier the main difference is our Area doesn't have the population as a Columbus, Cleveland, Ect.....but it goes on here too......Everyone knows it....

Bolded for the truth.

Personally, I don't think it's that big of a deal. If a kid decides he wants to go play for Coach A instead of Coach B in a sport, who cares? The kid still has to try out for a spot on the team, and if your kid doesn't get picked over a kid who transferred in, maybe that means your kid needs to spend more time doing drills, fundamentals, etc. and less time whining about how someone is better at a sport than they are. That being said, if a kid transfers in and schools or coaches "fudge" paperwork, etc. to get that kid eligible to play faster, then I do think there's something to be said being an ethical/moral example to the students.

[Raider6309]

Anyone see this article about VASJ vs Northwestern? It has been taken down

Here's the article:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s ... clnk&gl=us

Here's the reaction on yappi:
http://yappi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=301062

Btw this article was the edited article. No one has the unedited version

[trojandave]

Cincinnati Summit Country Day beat my Portsmouth Trojans 53-37 in the 2012 D3 state championship game. The Knights won the game not because they were private, but because on that day they played better. The Trojans were a very talented team just like CSCD, but just didn't play a really good game, and in addition All-Ohio Dion McKinley was hampered by a sore ankle suffered in the semifinal win over Ottawa-Glandorf. I felt that Portsmouth had a clear advantage at the center position, with McKinley over the Knights postman Holden Hertzel. But Dion was not nearly 100% yet still played. Wayne Evans and Jayllen Carter had 45 points combined vs. Ottawa-Glandorf, but only scored 2 combined vs. CSCD. They just had one of those games, and unfortunately it came in the state championship. If CSCD and Portsmouth played again, chances are they wouldn't combine for only 2 points.

Point being, no matter what system anyone comes up with, it will never be a perfect system of so-called competitive balance. At Portsmouth, we have survived and am still winning district championships, going to the regional finals, state semifinals, or the state championship game. We have won for 100 years despite being reclassified into other divisions, still winning despite dropping enrollment, and still winning because we refuse to submit to the "woe is me" mentality.

Just for the record, Portsmouth is 78-32 all time vs. Columbus schools, 21-11 vs. Dayton schools, and 23-12 vs. Cincinnati schools, 1-1 vs. Cleveland schools in the state tournament (Cleveland Cathedral Latin and Cleveland Central Catholic)

Friday morning it will be Fairland vs. Cleveland Villa-Angela St.Joseph.......as I have said, Fairland CAN WIN THE GAME, in part because they have a talented team that has played together now for several years. I just hope afterward it doesn't turn into a private vs. public debate. It's the Dragons vs. the Vikings for the right to play in the championship final.

By the way, Fairland beat perennial basketball private school power Dayton Chaminade-Julienne this year, one of the most prominent programs in the Dayton area and well respected around the state.

[dragonalum]

Anyone see this article about VASJ vs Northwestern? It has been taken down

Here's the article:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s ... clnk&gl=us

Here's the reaction on yappi:
http://yappi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=301062

Btw this article was the edited article. No one has the unedited version

The edited article still got flagged by the filters on my school's IP.

After reading some of the discussion in the Yappi threads, I got enough of the idea behind the article to know that it wasn't good.
That being said, I hope for all that is good and right about my little hometown that a writer from the H-D or Ironton Tribune has enough journalistic integrity and ethics not to write something like that if Fairland would lose to VASJ. I understand there's a "city v. country" mentality everywhere, but blatant prejudice when speaking about high school students is wrong on so many levels.