Three things that happened at OU today

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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

Post by Abe Froman »

The script from "The Newsroom" with Jeff Daniels as the actor.


There are some things you should know, and one of them is that there is absolutely no evidence to support the statement that we're the greatest country in the world. We're seventh in literacy, twenty-seventh in math, twenty-second in science, forty-ninth in life expectancy, 178th in infant mortality, third in median household income, number four in labor force, and number four in exports. We lead the world in only three categories: number of incarcerated citizens per capita, number of adults who believe angels are real, and defense spending, where we spend more than the next twenty-six countries combined, twenty-five of whom are allies. None of this is the fault of a 20-year-old college student, but you, nonetheless, are without a doubt, a member of the WORST-period-GENERATION-period-EVER-period, so when you ask what makes us the greatest country in the world, I don't know what the %^$# you're talking about?!

We sure used to be. We stood up for what was right! We fought for moral reasons, we passed and struck down laws for moral reasons. We waged wars on poverty, not poor people. We sacrificed, we cared about our neighbors, we put our money where our mouths were, and we never beat our chest. We built great big things, made ungodly technological advances, explored the universe, cured diseases, and cultivated the world's greatest artists and the world's greatest economy. We reached for the stars, and we acted like men. We aspired to intelligence; we didn't belittle it; it didn't make us feel inferior. We didn't identify ourselves by who we voted for in the last election, and we didn't scare so easy. And we were able to be all these things and do all these things because we were informed. By great men, men who were revered. The first step in solving any problem is recognizing there is one—America is not the greatest country in the world anymore.


Now that is two paragraphs of truth, no matter your political persuasion it is simple and factual...but let's concentrate on transgender bathrooms and if someone doesn't feel safe if they read some graffiti or whatever the next dumb thing is...please. We have lost our way because of this nonsense.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

Post by dazed&confused »

America is not a serial drama. I would still take America over any country on Earth. I am a child of the 60's and 70's Abe. Always question authority. I don't have all the answers and am deeply suspicious of anyone who claims they do.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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I read Abe's comments at the Washington Post on topics and he sure sounds like a D. :lol:


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

Post by Paladin »

BTW, the "transgender" issue was settled but the Neanderthals insist on making it a "war", just like the phony war on Christmas, praying in school, etc. No one stops anyone from practicing their religion at home or in church but trying to use the govt to promote publically any religion and wrists get slapped. Just a big mountain out of a molehill. And another stupid wedge issue to divert attention from the major issues of the day ....... economic justice, jobs, healthcare, etc


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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dazed&confused wrote:America is not a serial drama. I would still take America over any country on Earth. I am a child of the 60's and 70's Abe. Always question authority. I don't have all the answers and am deeply suspicious of anyone who claims they do.
America is not a serial drama? I agree it should not be, but consider the following:

4,500 students attending public universities in 35 states were polled on the following type questions. How many senators are there in the U.S.. What month does America vote for President in and how often does that take place? What song is the national anthem? What is the first and last sentence or stanza in the national anthem? And 5-6 more along those lines. They were then asked questions about The Kardashians reality show and some other MTV reality shows, etc.. My recollection is there were 8 questions a piece each way.

The result is astonishing in that net results was these 4,500 students scored 60% higher on the "serial drama" questions, averaging something like 4 more correct answers on the reality shows than on basic, and I mean basic national questions.

So you be the judge d&c...maybe America is becoming a serial drama.

You can question authority, indeed I often do myself, but take of your 1960's rose colored glasses my friend...cause this "ain't" the same America that this country's greatest generation fought for and defended. No one has all the right answers least of all little ole me, an ironworker turned entrepreneur, but I do know when you headed in a wrong direction to stop, gather yourself, and make a wiser choice.

Question is which choice is wise.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Paladin wrote:BTW, the "transgender" issue was settled but the Neanderthals insist on making it a "war", just like the phony war on Christmas, praying in school, etc. No one stops anyone from practicing their religion at home or in church but trying to use the govt to promote publically any religion and wrists get slapped. Just a big mountain out of a molehill. And another stupid wedge issue to divert attention from the major issues of the day ....... economic justice, jobs, healthcare, etc
Economic justice?

Equal is by definition unfair is it not? I do more work than another guy, but because Bernie (and now Hillary since she has been drug into his nonsense) says we should both be paid the same.

So I suppose we are just all yellow rubber ducks floating in a big pond. Just pick out any yellow rubber duck, it doesn't matter since we will provide = productivity or knowledge, and we should all be paid the same. Really. Maybe if I do more I should be rewarded more? Nope, I should not be rewarded more, I should be shamed more for working harder or smarter and give it to someone else.

Jobs, Healthcare are worthy topics but this snowball of economic justice is a wedge issue just like the Republicans and religion, guns (pick a topic).

Be nice to have a debate on real issues...hopefully it happens.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Cmon, Abe . Stop the BS. I never said "equal" anywhere. I said "economic justice". That means paying people better, keeping jobs in this country, providing for a sound SS and medicare, etc. The term "work" is complete BS as I can show you really hard workers who make next to nothing and others who actually don't work but are paid a king's salary . You will find I'm a capitalists at heart but WITH rules and regs, not free for all capitalism which produces the crony capitalism we see today. Another fine example of the R's ' deregulation " and love affair with "free markets".

BTW, are you simply a troll as your Washington Post comments put you squarely in the D camp.........? :lol:


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Paladin, my friend I have said for many a moon I am probably one to two steps left of center in my political beliefs, have voted that way with the exception of Reagan and maybe a few other times in state and local competitions where it is more about the person's abilities rather than political party affiliation.

Having said that, you and d&c seem remarkably articulate and well versed about the national social landscape, so, indeed, I think you "get" my frustration with the fact that we as a country are no longer 1-2 steps left of center. Rather the pendulum has swung to the left edge of the continuum in my view and if not corrected (by vote), will soon be corrected by a revolution of people that frankly has grown weary of those that continue to make choices that the majority no longer wants to pay for.

My observation is we as a country do best 1-2 steps left of center. That is where we recognize that it is a worthy goal and value for working men and women to be able to support, raise and educate a family. Have access to health-care and provisions for retirement and savings. The unions (which I am a member of) were established toward that end, to create a balance with management and owners to improve safe working conditions, bargain for a middle-class wage and benefits. When this country was most successful there was an unspoken push-pull between companies and working men and women that enabled a giant middle-class to prosper.

That push-pull has now turned on one hand to greed-fraud-corruption by those classified by some as "Wall Street" investment/hedge fund types. And on the other end an ever increasing group of people that simply believe because they exist they are entitled irregardless of the fact they do not work, or think most jobs are "beneath" them, so therefore not worthy of their toil and labor. I am frustrated by both, but becoming increasingly frustrated by the latter. I can combat the former easier than the latter honestly, and frankly the latter is more dangerous to the nation as a whole.

Just my views here from 1 step left of center.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Abe, I respect your intellect but simply disagree with your view. You hold some good ideas but missed the big picture. I also believe we work best as a nation one or two steps to the Left of center. Yet conservative "principles" darn near killed this country financially under W. Waging an unpaid for war off the books, huge tax cuts for the wealthy and business, exporting jobs overseas, skyrocketing deficits, etc. Presto -- then he needs a bailout of the banks and Wall Street. Then, add in a Congress under "control " of a minority ( tea party) of a minority party ( R) and you have NOTHING getting done while the country slides under water. Gerrymandering allowed even more extreme conservatives into the abyss. Those idiots want a phony war on Christmas, prayer in school, anti-abortion, etc that tear down the fabric of the country while allowing the major financial problems to consume everyone in the Middle class and Poor. Poorly paid jobs, exporting jobs over seas, refusing to fix SS and Medicare, etc.

You are correct that many have their hand out and don't want to work. But we have always had that. I remember as a kid the "hobos" who came door to door looking for a handout. I lived during the 50's, a time of great prosperity for all ,while tax rates reached the 90%. The trouble however , with your line of thinking is, there are NOWHERE near enough jobs to provide to all WHO WANT TO WORK and those who do, struggle to feed their families with minimum wage jobs or near that,as that is most that is available. Kids graduate from college and can't find jobs because there are NONE. We have ALLOWED an Extreme conservative R party to transfer jobs over seas. refuse to increase minimum wage, eliminate benefits and retirement while demanding more tax cuts for themselves and killing off NLRB so unions are no longer something they have to deal with. Its not the Left that is a problem, its the Extreme Far Right conservatives and every time the Left attempts in Congress to address these issues, all of which would change this country back to the the MUCH BETTER, conservatives kill it. Aliens, legal or otherwise are here at the REQUEST of business to provide CHEAP, CHEAP, CHEAP labor. This country is manufacturing millionaires and billionaires at a record pace, yet the BS propaganda does NOT produce a "trickle " down effect. Hence more lies that the uneducated masses consume.

Yes there will be a revolution coming The poorly educated are following an idiot in Trump who promises to fix the problems I outlined above , yet we know he is BSing the public. His is the most extreme cutting of taxes for the wealthy among all the candidates. He has NO POLICY for job creation as do all Rs. They are not in this for the workers. They are in politics for the OWNERS. Such as yourself.

The country is in the grip of the Extreme Far Right and conservatives will kill the country off with the plutocracy that is being created by the Rs.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Abe, I am surprised you voted for Reagan,you say you are a big union guy and he was known as anti union with that debacle over the air traffic guys and stacking the labor board with anti union people.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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To clarify, Abe is a card carrying member as a TRADE unionist. But he OWNS the company for which the trade work is done by HIS EMPLOYEES , who are also REQUIRED to be members of the Union. I know maNY CONTRACTORS,.... ELECTRICAL, PLUMBING, Bricklayers, etc who hold a union card, but don't actually perform the work. They run the business, one that THEY OWN. Their employees do the union work. Its typical politics.... claim to be a union member when in fact, other than holding the union card, they are simply business owners and more aligned with Rs whose politics always favor business and not workers, who are politically represented by Ds . Yet, you can claim to be a "card carrying " member of a union.

"yawn"

Politics has one party pulling a snow job on a dumb public to claim to be something they are not. Happens all the time.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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cbolt wrote:Abe, I am surprised you voted for Reagan,you say you are a big union guy and he was known as anti union with that debacle over the air traffic guys and stacking the labor board with anti union people.
Doesn't Reagan go back to anti union from his Hollywood days.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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It won't be long until they change Logan's mascot


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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noreply66 wrote:
cbolt wrote:Abe, I am surprised you voted for Reagan,you say you are a big union guy and he was known as anti union with that debacle over the air traffic guys and stacking the labor board with anti union people.
Doesn't Reagan go back to anti union from his Hollywood days.
Actually he was a member of an actors union and was even a Demo back then,guess Nancy flipped him :lol:
Last edited by cbolt on Thu Apr 21, 2016 12:42 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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cbolt wrote:
noreply66 wrote:
cbolt wrote:Abe, I am surprised you voted for Reagan,you say you are a big union guy and he was known as anti union with that debacle over the air traffic guys and stacking the labor board with anti union people.
Doesn't Reagan go back to anti union from his Hollywood days.
Actually he was a member of an actors union back then,guess Nancy flipped him :lol:
Ole Nancy was a good women.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Just say no trench!


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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cbolt wrote:Just say no trench!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Paladin wrote:To clarify, Abe is a card carrying member as a TRADE unionist. But he OWNS the company for which the trade work is done by HIS EMPLOYEES , who are also REQUIRED to be members of the Union. I know maNY CONTRACTORS,.... ELECTRICAL, PLUMBING, Bricklayers, etc who hold a union card, but don't actually perform the work. They run the business, one that THEY OWN. Their employees do the union work. Its typical politics.... claim to be a union member when in fact, other than holding the union card, they are simply business owners and more aligned with Rs whose politics always favor business and not workers, who are politically represented by Ds . Yet, you can claim to be a "card carrying " member of a union.

"yawn"

Politics has one party pulling a snow job on a dumb public to claim to be something they are not. Happens all the time.
Not even close.

Went in as an apprentice at age 18. Worked with the tools till age 38 (while attending night school for college then same for MBA).

Still have been known to strap on the tools and set some red-iron or rod-bust if needed or if the mood sets in for me and I need some time away from the "business" side of the business. Nothing adds clarity to one's thinking like a week of manual labor, good for the soul too. Only thing I can't do is weld because of continuity requirements within the industry.

Multi-generation of IW's in my family, so your little analogy above isn't remotely close. Could work circles around most apprentices today even at my age.

I previously aligned myself with the D's as you call them, but there is a movement afoot within that party that frankly frightens me as we move toward what is essentially entitlement for those not willing to do or learn anything. The trade unions are starving for qualified people, but that is a lot like work and the current generation is a bit afraid of a little dirt and grime.

Time to move back to center from where Obama has taken us, could even be time to go one step to the right to clear out some of the nonsense and programs that have been implemented. Have to find a candidate first that can do this.


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Abe

I guess you are a little slow too. That "entitlement" started many decades ago under LBJ. Was cut back by Clinton. And Obama. What I find funny is much of Obama policies are moderated and he has the screaming Far Left wing of his party yelling at him because he is so moderate. Hillary is even more moderate than he is and holds some conservative views. Yet , you won't hear that coming from Rs. The extremists there are openly fighting with members of their OWN party as not being conservative enough calling them "rinos". Those idiots are against Liberals, moderates, independents, R & D who won't follow their extreme positions.

Despite the cutbacks on welfare, the extreme right still complains about "entitlement" programs. Even bread lines are too liberal for them !

Polls would suggest that even Rs see the need for entitlement programs in the economic mess going forward. Tough luck. :roll:


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Re: Three things that happened at OU today

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Paladin wrote:Abe

I guess you are a little slow too. That "entitlement" started many decades ago under LBJ. Was cut back by Clinton. And Obama. What I find funny is much of Obama policies are moderated and he has the screaming Far Left wing of his party yelling at him because he is so moderate. Hillary is even more moderate than he is and holds some conservative views. Yet , you won't hear that coming from Rs. The extremists there are openly fighting with members of their OWN party as not being conservative enough calling them "rinos". Those idiots are against Liberals, moderates, independents, R & D who won't follow their extreme positions.

Despite the cutbacks on welfare, the extreme right still complains about "entitlement" programs. Even bread lines are too liberal for them !

Polls would suggest that even Rs see the need for entitlement programs in the economic mess going forward. Tough luck. :roll:
Wasn't talking about entitlement "programs". Read the post again.

I spoke of an entitlement "generation" that I fear we are becoming, where entry-level positions or work that requires the exertion of manual labor type work is being shunned by a large part of the work force because that work is "beneath" them. U.S. Department of Labor has 5 million jobs posted that aren't being filled. The vast majority of the descriptions of these jobs if you read through them sound a lot like work.

We need jobs where we make things. Here. On this soil. That solves a lot of problems. Whoever can convince me they will do that gets my vote.


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