Logan Football League Talk

[Johnny Quest]

Warren , Belpre , Federal Hocking , and Vinton County allowed N-Y into the TVC in 1970 when they " cut and run" from the SEOAL. Men don't hold grudges for 30 years , really ?

[dazed&confused]

I was never one to talk about cut and run. People need to get over it, whatever it is. SEO can't afford grudges. What we need is good football in the region every Friday night in the fall.

[NYBuckeye96]

Warren , Belpre , Federal Hocking , and Vinton County allowed N-Y into the TVC in 1970 when they " cut and run" from the SEOAL. Men don't hold grudges for 30 years , really ?

Those grudges are still there in certain circles. Personally, I would love to see Warren back in the TVC. NY is one of the few schools in the TVC that has supported the SEOAL schools in TVC expansion efforts.

The TVC was really the only conference that could have kept the SEOAL schools together due to geography. Now the SEOAL schools are scattered across multiple conferences and old rivalries will die off while new ones are created.

[Jim Ryan]

Warren , Belpre , Federal Hocking , and Vinton County allowed N-Y into the TVC in 1970 when they " cut and run" from the SEOAL. Men don't hold grudges for 30 years , really ?

Those grudges are still there in certain circles. Personally, I would love to see Warren back in the TVC. NY is one of the few schools in the TVC that has supported the SEOAL schools in TVC expansion efforts.

The TVC was really the only conference that could have kept the SEOAL schools together due to geography. Now the SEOAL schools are scattered across multiple conferences and old rivalries will die off while new ones are created.

Southern was the other school that was for bringing in the SEOAL schools. We need to split it up so we don't have to play Wahama in basketball and Nelsonville doesn't have to play Athens in anything. I know that's what they want. So I say bring them in and move Trimble and Wahama up to the middle division.

[formerfcfan]

Logan's school officials, if they haven't already, should pay very close attention to this.

When that gets completed, they should invite representatives from the OCC, Hamilton Twp, and Teays Valley to make a trip to Logan. Representatives from those institutions can leave their school building at 3pm and see how long it takes to get to Logan when this project gets finished.

It won't be for a couple years, but if you don't think the perception of traveling to Logan from the Franklin County line after school, during rush hour, has any sway in "thanks but no thanks" from the OCC & MSL... then I don't know what to tell you.

[cbolt]

About time they got rid of that thing! Been a major bottleneck for years,now if they could only get rid of the Pickerington Rd. light.

[Chieftain Fan]

There is a lot of opportunities along the US 33 Corridor from Cbus to the River. Many teams that would have a benefit of travel ( safety ), Computer points and continued rivalries . Lots of schools only 10-15 min off 33. Logan's best bet is a realignment with the MSL . That being said Logan will have to sit and wait. In Chieftain Country we will continue to be hopeful for our students to compete in a league that will be a good fit for all schools in that league.

[Abe Froman]

Matter of time before realignment in the MSL will allow for Logan to enter.

My guess is by 2018.

[LHS 72]

One thing that can't be denied; Logan fans travel well for football which means good gates. If and when they find another league elsewhere, other local teams will suffer $$$$

Logan has had a long history of outstanding fan and community support! What ever league accepts Logan will be very happy with the gates and the participation in all league sports!

[Omega]

Logan isn't in a enviable position at the moment. The only thing they can do is sit and wait to see if any leagues expand and want them.

On the other hand, Logan can afford to be patient and make the correct choice of a league home in the future. Logan can survive and even prosper as an independent until the best conference situation comes along.

[NY BUCKS]

I'm not against Warren coming to the tvc.
I also think Jackson should be in also..
I would like to see


NY
Athens
Jackson
Vinton
Meigs
Wellston
Gallia or logan

[enigmaax]

Had Warren not "cut and run" from the TVC in 1986, the Warriors wouldn't be trying to find a home right now. Those old grudges kept Warren from being welcomed back to the TVC.

Does anyone here know why Warren left and why it caused such hard feelings?

I have never really heard the full story. It *seems* as though it shouldn't have been such a big deal to the TVC from these two stanpoints: 1) the TVC still had 9 teams, so it isn't like they were left scrambling for a replacement and 2) wasn't Warren quite a bit bigger than most of the schools at the time (and since), which wouldn't exactly be "cutting and running" but rather not choosing to pick on little schools just because they happened to already be in the league?

I'm really interested to hear anyone who knows why it is something that still burns people after 30 years (if that is actually true).

[warrior90]

Well I was coming out of grade school at the time, but what I was told was that Warren had won or tied for several league championships in football, believe it or not, and had went 9-1 for 3 years out of 4 in the early 80's and was not even close to making the playoffs. (Warren has never made a playoff). So to try to get to that next level we had to play teams that were bigger and we were playing the likes of miller, fed hocking, trimble, and winning by 40 -60 points and that was not helping us. Also our arch rival at the time was Belpre and they were smaller than us and would make the playoffs with 8-2 records. So the powers to be felt the only way to get to the playoffs, with what we thought were good teams, was to go to the SEOAL and play bigger schools. Obviously the three or four really good years have yet to repeat themselves and now we are where we are. That is what I was told at least but do not take this as the only reason.

[enigmaax]

Well I was coming out of grade school at the time, but what I was told was that Warren had won or tied for several league championships in football, believe it or not, and had went 9-1 for 3 years out of 4 in the early 80's and was not even close to making the playoffs. (Warren has never made a playoff). So to try to get to that next level we had to play teams that were bigger and we were playing the likes of miller, fed hocking, trimble, and winning by 40 -60 points and that was not helping us. Also our arch rival at the time was Belpre and they were smaller than us and would make the playoffs with 8-2 records. So the powers to be felt the only way to get to the playoffs, with what we thought were good teams, was to go to the SEOAL and play bigger schools. Obviously the three or four really good years have yet to repeat themselves and now we are where we are. That is what I was told at least but do not take this as the only reason.

Which all makes sense and was along the lines of what I was thinking. So from the other side, why would that cause so much butthurt to TVC members? Like, if the big school didn't want to keep pummeling your little schools, why would that tick you off to the extent that you aren't over it 30 years later?

And I was in grade school at the time; I remember the perception of Warren being a really good football program. The Belpre-Warren games were a crazy atmosphere for rural sports for someone my age.

[NYBuckeye96]

I always heard that Warren left due to the perception of not being able to make the playoffs in the TVC. Keep in mind that Warren left in 1986. Back in the early 80s, their were only 5 divisions and only 2 teams per region made the playoffs. In the 70s, there were only 3 divisions. When NY won the state championship in '81, the Buckeyes only played 3 playoff games - the Regional Championship, State Semifinals and State Championship. So to be fair to Warren, back then, it would have required an undefeated season to make the playoffs because so few teams made the playoffs and Warren was larger than many teams in the TVC. Little did anyone know at the time that the playoffs would expand so much over the years.

I know that in the 70s and 80s, Belpre was the king of the TVC in Football, followed by Nelsonville-York. NY didn't pass Belpre in the number of all-time TVC Championships until the 90s. Belpre and NY were the two TVC teams that experienced the playoffs back when it was so hard to qualify. So in most years, Warren had at least one, if not two, losses to Belpre and Nelsonville-York and that meant no playoffs when only two teams per region qualified. I'm not sure what the Belpre-Warren series looked like in terms of wins and losses, but NY had a winning record against Warren. I think Trimble more than held its own against Warren as well, although I'm not sure what the overall record was in that series.

So the reason Warren left wouldn't even be a reason to leave today because the playoffs have expanded so much over the years. Another point is the fact that the TVC split into divisions in 1993. Therefore, had Warren stayed, they would not have played the likes of Miller or Federal Hocking anymore because they were placed in the smaller division. Those three games were pretty much automatic wins for the powers in the TVC every year and didn't provide many playoff points.

Had Warren held out a few more years, it's concerns would have been moot points. Now for the question why people have held grudges for so long, I honestly have no idea what the answer to that is.

Here is what the TVC looked like in Warren's last years (year each team joined the conference in parenthesis):

Alexander Spartans - 1974
Belpre Golden Eagles - 1969
Federal Hocking Lancers - 1969
Meigs Marauders - 1983
Miller Falcons - 1983
Nelsonville-York Buckeyes - 1970
Trimble Tomcats - 1978
Vinton County Vikings -1969
Warren Warriors - 1969
Wellston Golden Rockets - 1982

[NYBuckeye96]

Here is the Warren vs. NY series history - 19 total games played:

NY leads all-time series 11 wins, 7 losses, 1 tie
1967 Nelsonville-York (A) 22-6
1968 Nelsonville-York (H) 6-0
1969 Warren (A) 33-0
1970 Warren (H) 64-0
1971 Warren (A) 22-7
1972 Nelsonville-York (H) 39-6
1973 Warren (A) 14-7
1974 Tie (H) 0-0
1975 Warren (A) 15-0
1976 Nelsonville-York (H) 22-21
1977 Nelsonville-York (A) 41-0
1978 Nelsonville-York (H) 32-18
1979 Nelsonville-York (A) 20-6
1980 Nelsonville-York (H) 33-0
1981 Nelsonville-York (A) 34-13
1982 Nelsonville-York (H) 14-6
1983 Nelsonville-York (A) 8-0
1984 Warren (H) 19-14
1985 Warren (A) 25-8

[NYBuckeye96]

I found the Trimble-Warren series history on trimblefootball.com. Trimble joined the TVC in 1978 and won 5 of the 8 conference games....

1978 Trimble 27-8
1979 Trimble 9-7
1980 Trimble 35-15
1981 Warren 21-20
1982 Warren 21-7
1983 Trimble 14-0
1984 Trimble 27-10
1985 Warren 37-21

[NY BUCKS]

I know of 3 Warren football titles and
1 of those was a 3 way tie..NY Warren alex.
So as far as Warren local being a power that didn't happen in football.

[enigmaax]

I know of 3 Warren football titles and
1 of those was a 3 way tie..NY Warren alex.
So as far as Warren local being a power that didn't happen in football.

I didn't say power, but here was the condition of the program.

They hired Red Hill as head coach in 1979 after consecutive 2-win seasons. Hill had gone undefeated at Fort Frye in 1974 (FF's fieldhouse is named in his honor) and won over 200 games in his career. Warren went 9-1 in 1981, 1982, and 1985 and lost 3 games in both 1983 and 1984. A five year run of 40-9-1 is pretty solid, yet they were anywhere from 60-90 average points away from the top spot in the region.

Considering the TVC required 9 league games, the points just simply would never be there regardless of how good or bad teams actually were. There were several small schools and a maximum number of wins because everyone only had one non-league contest.

Lots of wins, a great coach in charge...everything looked good at that time. They went 8-2 in 1986 (first year in SEOAL) & were already closer to the playoffs than they had been in any of their 9-win seasons.

It didn't work out as they had a bit of a downturn and Hill only coached 3 more years, but there was a lot of promise at the time the move was made.

[NY BUCKS]

I understand the playoff points Warren didn't get
I just don't see how it helped them to leave.i think
Warren since leaving the tvc has 4-5 winning seasons since 85...